Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

billh58

(6,642 posts)
Tue Feb 11, 2014, 08:55 PM Feb 2014

Dionne: Violent right-wing talk helps block sane gun laws

From an E. J. Dionne OP published in the Washington Post on 9/12/2011, and is just as (if not more) true today as it was then:

http://www.chron.com/opinion/outlook/article/Dionne-Violent-right-wing-talk-8232-helps-block-1611238.php

- Snip -

"But in part from e-mail exchanges with ardent foes of gun control over the years, I came to realize that the real passion for a let-anything-go approach to guns has little to do with culture or hunting. It is rooted in a very peculiar view of how America has maintained its freedom. Rep. Ron Paul, as is his wont, expressed it as plainly as anyone.

"The Second Amendment is not about hunting deer or keeping a pistol in your nightstand," the Texas Republican declared in 2006. "It is not about protecting oneself against common criminals. It is about preventing tyranny. The Founders knew that unarmed citizens would never be able to overthrow a tyrannical government as they did.… The muskets they used against the British army were the assault rifles of that time
."

- Snip -

"And at a Washington rally last year on the anniversary of the Oklahoma City bombing, Rep. Paul Broun, R-Ga., linked this view to the current occupant of the White House.

"Fellow patriots, we have a lot of domestic enemies of the Constitution, and they're right down the Mall, in the Congress of the United States - and right down Independence Avenue in the White House that belongs to us," he declared. "It's not about my ability to hunt, which I love to do. It's not about the ability for me to protect my family and my property against criminals, which we have the right to do. But it's all about us protecting ourselves from a tyrannical government of the United States
."

The notion that the Second Amendment affirms the right of "The People" to take up arms against the lawfully elected government of the United States is pervasive throughout the ranks of the Second Amendment absolutists. The fact of the matter is, that although some of the Founders were fearful of the formation of a "standing army," we in fact have one of the largest "standing" military organizations in the world. Is that fact a violation of the Second Amendment? Does the Second Amendment give Billy Bob Sixpack free reign to carry his AK-47 into the Oval Office and start shooting? Ted Nugent thinks that it does, and by his silence so does Wayne LaPierre.

The final two paragraphs of the dissent in Heller written by Justice Stevens point out the challenges for the lawmakers moving forward, and for the various courts, including the SCOTUS, which will review those gun control laws:

"I do not know whether today’s decision will increase the labor of federal judges to the “breaking point” envisioned by Justice Cardozo, but it will surely give rise to a far more active judicial role in making vitally important national policy decisions than was envisioned at any time in the 18th, 19th, or 20th centuries.

The Court properly disclaims any interest in evaluating the wisdom of the specific policy choice challenged in this case, but it fails to pay heed to a far more important policy choice—the choice made by the Framers themselves. The Court would have us believe that over 200 years ago, the Framers made a choice to limit the tools available to elected officials wishing to regulate civilian uses of weapons, and to authorize this Court to use the common-law process of case-by-case judicial lawmaking to define the contours of acceptable gun control policy. Absent compelling evidence that is nowhere to be found in the Court’s opinion, I could not possibly conclude that the Framers made such a choice
."

http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/07-290.ZD.html

5 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Dionne: Violent right-wing talk helps block sane gun laws (Original Post) billh58 Feb 2014 OP
Article 3 section 3 defines treason as taking up arms against the government. flamin lib Feb 2014 #1
They didn't mean billh58 Feb 2014 #3
Nope. They didn't differentiate. It says what it says. nt flamin lib Feb 2014 #5
Ever notice how quiet our "Democratic" Gun Enthusiasts were...... Paladin Feb 2014 #2
They tend to use the billh58 Feb 2014 #4

flamin lib

(14,559 posts)
1. Article 3 section 3 defines treason as taking up arms against the government.
Wed Feb 12, 2014, 09:39 AM
Feb 2014

If the founding fathers meant for citizens to be able to fight the government why did they put that in the body of the Constitution?

billh58

(6,642 posts)
3. They didn't mean
Wed Feb 12, 2014, 01:51 PM
Feb 2014

for citizens to take up arms against the government. The Second Amendment was written to establish a civilian militia (similar to what Switzerland employs) in lieu of a standing army.

Congress has the power to establish a standing army -- and they did.

Right-wing Second Amendment absolutists, and the five right-wing SCOTUS justices (as so eloquently pointed out by Justice Stevens in his dissent in Heller) have misinterpreted the simple one sentence Second Amendment to fit their own profit motivated agenda -- at the behest of the NRA (ALEC/Koch Brothers) and at the expense of the overwhelming majority of Americans who do not own guns.

The notion that the various states' civilian "militias" have any sort of relevancy to the "security of a free State," or that they are "well regulated" is ridiculous.

Paladin

(28,980 posts)
2. Ever notice how quiet our "Democratic" Gun Enthusiasts were......
Wed Feb 12, 2014, 10:38 AM
Feb 2014

....when Dick Cheney was in power, making our nation safe for governmental torture programs and hyper-invasive monitoring? I wonder how they react at the gun range, when some fur-bearing reactionary starts mouthing off about Obama being the second coming of Adolph Hitler? I imagine they're pretty quiet then, as well. The gun rights movement has very little to do with the prevention of governmental tyranny. Thanks to the always-sharp E.J. Dionne for highlighting this.

billh58

(6,642 posts)
4. They tend to use the
Wed Feb 12, 2014, 02:01 PM
Feb 2014

"broken clock is right twice a day" excuse when agreeing with the extreme right-wing, and the ALEC/Koch Brothers'-funded NRA. The fact is that right-wing Libertarians posing as Democrats are as transparent as Saran Wrap, especially when they use NRA propaganda as an argument for the unlimited proliferation of guns, and more guns.

Latest Discussions»Issue Forums»Gun Control Reform Activism»Dionne: Violent right-win...