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I never want to hear these words from anyone ever again. (Original Post) Ray Bruns Jan 2025 OP
Yes it is a total lie. We were brainwashed into believing so much bullshit. Irish_Dem Jan 2025 #1
George Carlin.........perfect DENVERPOPS Jan 2025 #24
He was way ahead of the curve. We all laughed at the time. Irish_Dem Jan 2025 #38
That's chilling how Roc2020 Jan 2025 #72
All men (+women) are created equal.... magicarpet Jan 2025 #54
Ha ha. Women are still second class citizens. Irish_Dem Jan 2025 #60
Yep. Depressing, isn't it. Diamond_Dog Jan 2025 #76
Depressing and disgusting. Irish_Dem Jan 2025 #77
Completely!! InAbLuEsTaTe Jan 2025 #67
"No one is above the law." nt eppur_se_muova Jan 2025 #2
Which we now know is complete Different Drummer Jan 2025 #14
Well, we do know of one person who is somehow able to make sure HE is above the law. calimary Jan 2025 #46
How about DENVERPOPS Jan 2025 #21
Every person gets one vote, they just don't all count as much. nt Shermann Jan 2025 #66
Just like in Russia DENVERPOPS Jan 2025 #71
Did you believe in it before this day? WhiskeyGrinder Jan 2025 #3
I did when I was young. Starry eyed fourteen year old in high school. Ray Bruns Jan 2025 #5
I complained to my mother about having to recite the pledge daily at school. cyndensco Jan 2025 #49
I remember DENVERPOPS Jan 2025 #58
I used to misbehave during the pledge in elementary school. Lucky Luciano Jan 2025 #59
Blatantly false advertising that should be removed from the Supreme Whorehouse dalton99a Jan 2025 #4
Too bad for you. dchill Jan 2025 #6
Used to say that fucking shit every week at Boy Scouts. Had no idea it was a total crock of shit. SoFlaBro Jan 2025 #7
I stopped standing in high school and my children were taught not to stand. Keepthesoulalive Jan 2025 #12
My brother refused to do it pretty early on Meowmee Jan 2025 #51
Small town police radio scanners you hear important names that never that never get to court. IA8IT Jan 2025 #8
Here's another one: Stargleamer Jan 2025 #9
And "the US is a nation of laws"... Bettie Jan 2025 #13
... Different Drummer Jan 2025 #16
Yup.. please stop saying that.... 🤦🏻‍♀️ Most of us knew it was never true Meowmee Jan 2025 #52
The whole pledge can be banned LakeArenal Jan 2025 #10
1954 niyad Jan 2025 #30
During Eisenhower to distinguish us from the "godless" communists state of stupid Jan 2025 #31
With a big push from the bunch of dress-up clowns, the Knights of Columbus. NT BobsYourUncle Jan 2025 #48
Ain't that the truth DaBronx Jan 2025 #11
It is my sincere hope BigMin28 Jan 2025 #56
Yep DaBronx Jan 2025 #78
yeah. barbtries Jan 2025 #15
K & R Emile Jan 2025 #17
Likewise about the US being a shinning beacon of democracy. drray23 Jan 2025 #18
Nope, of course, when did they ever really ring true? Magoo48 Jan 2025 #19
"Don't do the crime if you cant do the time" bsiebs Jan 2025 #20
That depends on how much money and influence you have state of stupid Jan 2025 #32
Well, in spite of the fact that "liberty and justice for all" wnylib Jan 2025 #22
Just change the last word....... lastlib Jan 2025 #23
Perfect 😹 Just add Life to it as well Meowmee Jan 2025 #53
I get nauseous when I hear the word liberty it is such bs word that the right wingers throw out kimbutgar Jan 2025 #25
You still have the liberty to fight for everything you say is lost. You still have liberty. If you say you don't, ancianita Jan 2025 #27
But what happens when "we the people " are annihilated by his MAGAloons that he'll send out to go after kimbutgar Jan 2025 #29
Don't make up hypotheticals to continue your fear habit. Fear kills the soul and hardens hearts and minds. ancianita Jan 2025 #39
Proclaim what you want. But you can't love democracy, rule of law, liberty and justice for all ONLY WHEN YOU WIN. ancianita Jan 2025 #26
That seems like some very convoluted logic. Nt lostnfound Jan 2025 #43
How so? ancianita Jan 2025 #44
The OP writes of disillusionment. To be dis-illusioned is to free oneself from an illusion lostnfound Jan 2025 #74
The OP writes "I never want to hear..." "Disillusionment" is solely your interpretation, and thanks for your thoughts. ancianita Jan 2025 #75
Fair points, but on the other hand, pinning one's hope for "democracy" on the U.S. may be antiquated idea lostnfound Jan 2025 #79
The same people who make a mockery of the Rule of Law want to make kids pray and read the bible in school. sop Jan 2025 #28
I do. pandr32 Jan 2025 #33
And "no man is above the law." What a load of bullshit. Comfortably_Numb Jan 2025 #34
With Liberty and Justice for Some Little Frieda Jan 2025 #35
The Rule of Law is indeed dead. -misanthroptimist Jan 2025 #36
there's no justice, it's just us Celerity Jan 2025 #37
and I stopped singing the national anthem many years ago.. Permanut Jan 2025 #40
You are made blind to soo many things as someone who grows up in America... DSandra Jan 2025 #41
As long as we're tossing out antiquated American slogans... Xavier Breath Jan 2025 #42
Certainly bdamomma Jan 2025 #45
I thought you were going to say "Felon Trump." stollen Jan 2025 #47
I keep saying "with liberty and justice for all". regardless of the rest of the world and DU. Tetrachloride Jan 2025 #50
Right on!! Ferrets are Cool Jan 2025 #55
It is an ideal to work toward dlk Jan 2025 #57
The phrase "law and order" can also go fuck itself . . . hatrack Jan 2025 #61
"Patriot" Seinan Sensei Jan 2025 #62
I'd be happy if we could permanently and officially omit "Under God" * Oopsie Daisy Jan 2025 #63
I quit saying the pledge of allegiance long ago IzzaNuDay Jan 2025 #64
i actually chuckled when i read "and justice for all" nt orleans Jan 2025 #65
Well, that's one approach. I'd rather scream them at the top of my lungs at the end as an act of shaming and defiance. KatjeD Jan 2025 #68
Replace with "the pursuit of liberty and justice for all." HereForTheParty Jan 2025 #69
"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State...." Doc_Technical Jan 2025 #70
Haven't been able to say those words since Ford pardoned Nixon Attilatheblond Jan 2025 #73

DENVERPOPS

(11,714 posts)
24. George Carlin.........perfect
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 03:44 PM
Jan 2025

May he rest in peace, having tried to tell us all the way things really are:

George Carlin, 100% dead on, with this rant years ago, describing the future...............

&t=57s

Irish_Dem

(67,976 posts)
38. He was way ahead of the curve. We all laughed at the time.
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 04:59 PM
Jan 2025

But we are not laughing now.

Roc2020

(1,720 posts)
72. That's chilling how
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 02:28 PM
Jan 2025

accurate he was. The country is really in crisis never experienced before. I'm really fascinated curious and very watchful how Americans will respond or react.

Irish_Dem

(67,976 posts)
60. Ha ha. Women are still second class citizens.
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 11:15 AM
Jan 2025

With the GOP making it a crime to treat dying women, we are now lower than American livestock and pets.
People are allowed to treat dying pets and farm animals.

Irish_Dem

(67,976 posts)
77. Depressing and disgusting.
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 07:33 PM
Jan 2025

My Dad was US career military and he did not fly combat in three wars so his daughter and granddaughters
would be treated worse than gd barnyard animals.

calimary

(85,835 posts)
46. Well, we do know of one person who is somehow able to make sure HE is above the law.
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 12:03 AM
Jan 2025

That fucking orange-faced, forked-tongued BASTARD.

DENVERPOPS

(11,714 posts)
71. Just like in Russia
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 02:04 PM
Jan 2025

Like one of Hitler's henchmen once said, we don't care about the votes, we only care about who is counting them........

Ray Bruns

(5,124 posts)
5. I did when I was young. Starry eyed fourteen year old in high school.
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 02:38 PM
Jan 2025

Did a lot of growing up since then.

cyndensco

(1,743 posts)
49. I complained to my mother about having to recite the pledge daily at school.
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 10:09 AM
Jan 2025

She told me if I chose not to say it she would support me. In her opinion, the last line made the whole thing invalid.

I was in elementary school.

DENVERPOPS

(11,714 posts)
58. I remember
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 11:03 AM
Jan 2025

when all of a sudden in the 50's they ADDED the phrase, UNDER GOD.............

Lucky Luciano

(11,597 posts)
59. I used to misbehave during the pledge in elementary school.
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 11:12 AM
Jan 2025

Last edited Sat Jan 11, 2025, 03:35 PM - Edit history (1)

I would make childishly funny word changes or burp or not say it at all. As a 7 year old or so I somehow knew it did not feel right to just mindlessly do it. Nobody ever told me to be that way…but the school psychologist got involved because I wouldn’t comply!

dalton99a

(88,104 posts)
4. Blatantly false advertising that should be removed from the Supreme Whorehouse
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 02:36 PM
Jan 2025

"Equal Justice Under Law" my ass


SoFlaBro

(3,427 posts)
7. Used to say that fucking shit every week at Boy Scouts. Had no idea it was a total crock of shit.
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 02:46 PM
Jan 2025

Keepthesoulalive

(1,156 posts)
12. I stopped standing in high school and my children were taught not to stand.
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 03:07 PM
Jan 2025

We had to have a conversation with some of the teachers but they got my point.

Meowmee

(8,532 posts)
51. My brother refused to do it pretty early on
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 10:19 AM
Jan 2025

and they were furious but they could not force him to... I just did it because it had no real meaning to me then anyway

IA8IT

(6,121 posts)
8. Small town police radio scanners you hear important names that never that never get to court.
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 02:46 PM
Jan 2025

Justice is infinitely adjustable

BigMin28

(1,648 posts)
56. It is my sincere hope
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 10:36 AM
Jan 2025

that Garland is haunted by what is about to become of his precious DOJ. What he was so worried about protecting is about to be turned into a organized crime ring. He protected nothing.

barbtries

(30,321 posts)
15. yeah.
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 03:10 PM
Jan 2025

it's aspirational. but i have no desire to recite the pledge of allegiance. i don't swell with pride when i hear the national anthem. i used to. I remember walking down the street and thinking how lucky I was to have been born in the USA.

republicans turned it into a shithole country. If I had the means and my family was with me, I would leave.

As it is I will be here and I will be a part of The Opposition, and I will resist and i will not change, or shut up about it.

drray23

(8,198 posts)
18. Likewise about the US being a shinning beacon of democracy.
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 03:24 PM
Jan 2025

Loads of nonsense. We have zero credibility about going around wagging our finger at other countries for not being democracies.

wnylib

(25,223 posts)
22. Well, in spite of the fact that "liberty and justice for all"
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 03:37 PM
Jan 2025

has never been fully lived up to, I refuse to drop those words as a value to promote, despite corrupt courts and the power of oligarchs.

If those words are ever to have meaning as a reality, it will happen only when enough people are committed to those words to make them happen.

As a retired person, I am not exposed to settings where the pledge is recited. I do not feel a need or desire to recite the pledge and I take exception to other parts of it as well.

But I can and do feel committed to the goal of "liberty and justice for all."

lastlib

(25,715 posts)
23. Just change the last word.......
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 03:38 PM
Jan 2025

"...liberty and justice for the rich......"

"...one nation under tRump.... "

kimbutgar

(24,809 posts)
25. I get nauseous when I hear the word liberty it is such bs word that the right wingers throw out
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 03:45 PM
Jan 2025

While taking away voting rights, woman’s rights, LGBTQ rights. Where’s our liberty to have these freedoms?

ancianita

(40,267 posts)
27. You still have the liberty to fight for everything you say is lost. You still have liberty. If you say you don't,
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 03:50 PM
Jan 2025

you've abandoned all agency still left to every single one of We The People.

kimbutgar

(24,809 posts)
29. But what happens when "we the people " are annihilated by his MAGAloons that he'll send out to go after
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 03:53 PM
Jan 2025

Us and he’ll promise them immunity.

Remember Hitler 2.0 has total immunity in carrying out presidential duties. And who’s to say he won’t use it to go after his enemies in states that didn’t vote for him?

ancianita

(40,267 posts)
39. Don't make up hypotheticals to continue your fear habit. Fear kills the soul and hardens hearts and minds.
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 04:59 PM
Jan 2025

Why do you think "when "we the people " are annihilated" or "who's to say" when it didn't happen the first shot he took. Why do you think he's so powerful, or his "magaloons" are in such great numbers. They're not.
Biden has time and time again told you that "America is an idea." If you think an idea can die in the next four years, if you think that millions of your American brothers and sisters won't fight for their children's freedom and futures, think again.

It's a big country. Democracy has millions more allies than the 23% who voted for the Felon.

https://thefederalnewswire.com/stories/665892188-litigation-coalition-forming-to-confront-trump-administration-policies

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy_Alliance

https://www.propublica.org/topics/trump-administration

https://breakingnewsusa.com



Do NOT give in to your fear. Do not let your fear drive your imagination. Try not to post fear.
Take heart. Know that millions of all of us are together in this righteous fight for our descendants' future.



ancianita

(40,267 posts)
26. Proclaim what you want. But you can't love democracy, rule of law, liberty and justice for all ONLY WHEN YOU WIN.
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 03:49 PM
Jan 2025

Last edited Fri Jan 10, 2025, 08:16 PM - Edit history (1)







lostnfound

(16,914 posts)
74. The OP writes of disillusionment. To be dis-illusioned is to free oneself from an illusion
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 05:56 PM
Jan 2025

And an illusion is a falsehood.

I expect that the OP is NOT saying that he disagrees with the ideal of liberty and justice for all.

I presume that the OP is removing an illusion from his own mind that the United States, as a country, actually values liberty and justice for all. “Liberty and justice for all” is more of a slogan, a pretense, than an authentic value of the U.S. in 2025.

Pointing out the illusion, the deception, is a community service.

It’s quite a different area from “you can’t love your country only when you win”.
It’s more like “you can’t admit reality only when you are proud of it”.

ancianita

(40,267 posts)
75. The OP writes "I never want to hear..." "Disillusionment" is solely your interpretation, and thanks for your thoughts.
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 06:56 PM
Jan 2025

"I never want to hear..." is a statement of permanence.
It 'never wants to hear' any post of Biden OR the Felon saying it. Disillusionment, as you interpret it, is usually a temporary emotion that can drive what one says and does, but one needs to be careful about using always and never driven by a temporary emotion.
It's more helpful to sit with one's disillusionment than to later say "oh I really didn't mean that."

Appreciate your effort, but gotta say that as long as you choose to interpret the OP as disillusionment, any reader can also reasonably interpret "never want to hear" as a permanent removing of oneself from 'small d' democratic talk that reflects on America as an "idea," which Joe Biden has claimed for years. It can also be interpreted as a more permanent loss of faith in ideas upheld and defended by Americans since the founding.

But historically our losses don't reflect the best of our party or the country. Disillusion prevents one from an historical and/or numbers perspective -- that the majority of this country has not voted GOP for a long time, and this time, not for the criminality that surrounds the Felon or the Heritage ideas that will hurt them if enacted. Many high visibility figures have said this.

Overall, the words "never want" only reflect a personal reality. If they prove any relatable exterior reality, it's that rule of law, equality under the law, are down. But not out.

That's just my opinion.

lostnfound

(16,914 posts)
79. Fair points, but on the other hand, pinning one's hope for "democracy" on the U.S. may be antiquated idea
Tue Jan 14, 2025, 04:34 PM
Jan 2025

Some of the younger generation that i know is beyond fed up with the US land-of-vultures. They have found opportunity, civility, more educated people in other countries. On occasion they say they’d prefer to never come back, and if currently here, they say they can’t see themselves staying.

If they’ve had the experience of living abroad, they no longer find the US to be the seat of civilization, nor a place of “liberty and justice for all”. It’s not that they don’t believe in “liberty and justice for all” as an ideal, but they admire certain other countries as being closer to that ideal that our own.

You mention “faith in ideas”, but isn’t it “faith in America” where we may have some difference?

sop

(13,659 posts)
28. The same people who make a mockery of the Rule of Law want to make kids pray and read the bible in school.
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 03:52 PM
Jan 2025

Permanut

(6,961 posts)
40. and I stopped singing the national anthem many years ago..
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 05:04 PM
Jan 2025

"..the land of the free.."

More BS.

DSandra

(1,565 posts)
41. You are made blind to soo many things as someone who grows up in America...
Fri Jan 10, 2025, 06:02 PM
Jan 2025










This is just a small sample...

Tetrachloride

(8,649 posts)
50. I keep saying "with liberty and justice for all". regardless of the rest of the world and DU.
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 10:17 AM
Jan 2025

I expect it of myself and a few of my family appreciate my view.

Ferrets are Cool

(22,120 posts)
55. Right on!!
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 10:31 AM
Jan 2025
Students in elementary schools in my area are COMPELLED to say this bullshit every morning before class. It sickens my stomach to hear the indoctrination and lies coming from their mouths.

Seinan Sensei

(936 posts)
62. "Patriot"
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 11:47 AM
Jan 2025

Is another RW go-to word.
To them, any original meaning of this word is lost and gone forever.

Oopsie Daisy

(5,594 posts)
63. I'd be happy if we could permanently and officially omit "Under God" *
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 12:06 PM
Jan 2025

* and "In God We Trust".

IzzaNuDay

(936 posts)
64. I quit saying the pledge of allegiance long ago
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 12:08 PM
Jan 2025

I don’t do the hands to the heart, don’t say the words.

It’s a farce!

KatjeD

(8 posts)
68. Well, that's one approach. I'd rather scream them at the top of my lungs at the end as an act of shaming and defiance.
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 12:46 PM
Jan 2025

Just as I refuse to surrender the flag to the Neo-Nazis and Proud Boys, I'm not about to surrender my pledge to it either. The fascists may choose to think those words don't matter, but I am here to remind them with my last breath: "liberty and justice for all" means LIBERTY and JUSTICE for ALL.

Doc_Technical

(3,654 posts)
70. "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State...."
Sat Jan 11, 2025, 02:00 PM
Jan 2025

Militias are not necessary now.

As far as I'm concerned, the Second Amendment
only applies to muzzle loading, smooth bore,
black powder firearms.

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