If any cultist repents with convincing humiliation and contrition for making such a horrible mistake, I might consider forgiveness. But nomalizing and accepting voting for this turd as just a difference of political opinion? Never!

It would be absurd and naive to pretend that these are good people somehow led astray by Trump's charismatic sales pitch.

They are disgusting, hateful assholes in love with cruelty and empty displays of machismo.

Every last one of them could vanish tomorrow, and the world would be no poorer for it.

Some of them want the suffering and are cruel, angry people who aren't worth trying to save.
Some of them just don't understand politics very well and are in the information bubble. They really believe the lies they are being fed. The puppetmasters have raised the fooling of uneducated low information voters to an art. I keep meeting otherwise decent people who still don't know what's coming.
Yeah, they failed their responsibility and are poor at critical thinking, and we don't deserve to pay for their mistakes. But most of them do not desire the suffering that Trump is about to unleash. They are not the malignant narcissists. Trump and the oligarchs and the RW media are.

a clothing bank on Tuesdays and a food bank on Wednesdays I have met a few people who like you said are decent but also are not informed.

Last edited Tue Dec 24, 2024, 12:14 PM - Edit history (1)

Until then, they're all effectively the same.

The punishment for their culpably willful ignorance is that they should suffer the full impact of their culpably willful ignorance.


The distinction between bad & good Trump voter seems trivial, like someone asserting that they're not racist, they just support the racist and every one of his racist statements & policies.

They don't get a pass simply because they're lazy assholes.

I experience an overwhelming urge to run them off the road, rear-end them at traffic lights or slash their tires in parking lots. Luckily, I don't act on such feelings.

This isn't 2016 anymore - it's been 8 fucking years! We're owned, OK? You assholes got everything that you wanted and you're going to destroy this country. Give it a fucking rest already. So yeah fuck everyone who voted for the fucking asshole a second time around.

including a neighbor who saved my life in August by driving me 2 hours to an ER. In September he started with the Trump signs and he still has them up today. He saved my life then he voted to kill me. So to hell with him. I won't speak to him ever again. It is unforgivable. Another friend of 9 years desperately tried to get me to vote for Trump because he was afraid of Kamala's "taxes on unreal gains" as he put it. Won't ever speak with him again either. Voting for Trump was unforgivable itself, and pressuring me to vote for Trump was fatal to that friendship. I have not explained to either of these guys why I'm avoiding them and blocking them. And I don't care.

And I don’t want to have anything to do with people like that!

I agree with your decision 100%.

Most of my friends are Dems, but I would never cut a long time friend or family member out of my life because they have different views than me. My 2 Republican girl friends were there for me when I was sick - they grew up in conservative communities so it’s no shock they are Republicans even though we rarely mention politics.
I live outside a small town - probably half Dems & half Republicans. Our wonderful mayor is a Dem but also loved by many of the Republicans because he does so much for everyone. Mostly everyone is pretty friendly to everyone- I’m not going to not say Hi to a woman who has a Trump sign in her yard. This woman just lost her husband of 30 yrs and I choose to have compassion for her - not hate.

Trump killed the GOP.

But minorities, immigrants and trans people feel differently. They are marginalized and threatened.
They are feeling pain . Their reality is very different, don't say gay , woke, and equating immigrants to vermin. I’m glad your world is safe ,but that doesn’t apply to everyone.

or at least regulators for their investments and an fdic to protect their bank accounts .

with these scam artists, insider traders, and outright thieves in charge there will be a lot of destitute old people on the streets.

This is NOT about different “views”.

This is NOT about politics. Liz Cheney is a Republican and SHE didn’t vote for him. After Jan. 6th neither did my gun-toting Republican brother in law who is sure Jane’s Revenge is coming to inflict terror on his tiny rural town.

This is also, at least in my case, NOT about hate. These Trump voters are seriously morally disengaged. This makes them dangerous, first to any targeted groups but as the authoritarian government takes hold, to all of us. They have voted away democracy in favor of autocracy. When it dawns on many people, perhaps including you. that democracy needs to be defended, they will not act alongside you to defend it.

Most Germans were not die-hard Nazis. But most were or became morally disengaged. They VOTED HITLER INTO POWER. They stood by while the worst atrocities in history were committed. They turned in Anne Frank and her family. Ask yourself, honestly, were they good people? They were NOT. And neither is anyone who voted for Trump in 2024.

When you treat them just as you always have, you are ENABLING the harms they have voted to inflict. You are ENABLING their denial that their choice was morally indefensible. You are ENABLING them to persist in the illusion that they are good people. They are not.

i don't think they could be nearly as numerous or as violent as the "army of god" and other clinic bombers and doctor shooters.

Your approach would work if we stay at the level of corruption that we were at not so long ago. But, this new crop of Trumpian buddies are going to nag him into a more perverse behavior. This is what we fear. He has announced what amounts to atrocities. That's what we are going to be dealing with.

We can choose not to believe, and wait for it. Or, we can take him at his word and prepare for it. We have the example of history to know how these evil people get entrenched, when ordinary peaceful people are subjugated and used to keep the dictator in place.

If you woke up one morning and discovered that your whole neighborhood had been arrested and hauled off, and that one of those doing the arresting was your dear friend who saved your life once upon a time, would you still feel that you owe him something even though his political beliefs do not align with yours? It's even harder when the Trumpian believer is a family member.

You don't have to hate anyone. There is a whale of a difference between hate and anger. Right now I am angry with all Republicans. They can stay away from me. As a group, their blind worship of a mean, vile fat pig is enough to dim the lights. But, why is that woman putting Trump signs in her yard? She doesn't appear to care about YOU. If she's doing it as camouflage, that's trickier.

I admire your WWJD approach to the problem of Trump lackeys and enablers. I have discovered that I am not capable of that. I don't want anyone smiling and telling me that Trump is God and will save my soul. Actually, I'm asking every day for him to just disappear from the Earth. That's where I am. And since I paid my dues by arguing with otherwise smart but seemingly stupid family members, I'm not bothering with that anymore. I have one relative left. We keep it polite. He knows that my bubble is Trump free.

I'm quite likely to stay sharp on how Trump is ripping up our country, but I am tuning out otherwise. That's because I have discovered that not seeing Trump's scowling face or hearing his stupid pronouncements keeps me calm. We have to live like this for the next four years, being strong to resist, being embarrassed in front of the world, and figuring out how to save the template of our nation. It's going to be really, really hard to even be cordial to any Republican or person who voted for Trump.

But, that's reality. We let a monster skate. We are all in it together.

That says it all. You nailed it.

They’re complicit with the very real death and destruction Traitor has done and will do.

Thousands died because of his first administration’s actual and unintentional malice with Covid. Hundreds of migrant children will never be reunited with their families. Girls and women are being enslaved into unwanted pregnancies against their will - most are permanently scarred by that. Others are literally dying.

Nothing in there about cutting people off - just a declaration that they can’t forgive the complicit enablers to Traitor’s regime past and future.

but remember that these people with "different views" voted for someone hellbent on overturning Roe vs. Wade, which he was able to carry out, and which forced countless women to give birth against their will in different parts of this country, which caused extreme harm to these women, not to mention women who died because they were denied abortion care. These people with "different views" had no problem with such harms, in fact many of them heartily approved of what Trump did. Also, 28+ women have accused Trump of SA/sexual harassment/rape, and he was found guilty in a NY court of SA. These people with "different views" had no problem voting for such a person--by doing so these conservatives weren't there for these women. They voted for a rapist--let that sink in. In addition, Trump defamed an entire ethnic group--Haitian-Americans--by claiming, "they're eating the dogs, they're eating the cats". This by itself was sufficient evidence of Trump's racism, but these people with "different views" had no problem voting for him. They voted for a racist--let that sink in. Harboring such "different views" can cause extreme suffering in this country when they are expressed at the ballot box. In light of this, boycotting such people with "different views", (aka resentment for marginalized groups) is quite reasonable, as the consequences of such "different views" is so often extremely dire.

To not be friends? They support a bunch of them. Where do you draw the line? They support so.done who killed a bunch of people during covid. Where us the line you would draw? Is it ok that Germans supported Hitler?

And still not ever forget or forgive. My husband has mostly MAGAT friends and acquaintances. They have a lot of parties and social events that he always wants me to attend with him. Sometimes I beg off, but if I go, I'm just polite with small talk and have a strict two hour limit. People who vote Republican are either ignorant or evil or both - and I don’t like to spend any extra time with them.

MAGA is not a "different view." It's a dangerous cult. It is a fascist political movement. It is a declaration that they have cut us off, though they are dishonest about that because they like to toy with us the way a cat toys with a mouse.

I would never cut a long time friend or family member out of my life merely because they had different views than me, either. That's not what this is. This is about abuse, it is about cruelty. It is a one way street. You may be willing to accept them, but they will never reciprocate. That is what MAGA is.

If you had a friend or relative who always showed up drunk and misbehaved, you would stop inviting them, you would stop socializing with them. You wouldn't loan them your car, you wouldn't let them watch your kids. MAGA is far, far more dangerous than alcoholism.

These aren't disagreements about the appropriate capital gains tax rates for millionaires.

These are total disconnections regarding the underlying fabric of our society, about who is a person, about who gets to break and rewrite laws at will.

However, I do concur with you about the sadness of this thread.

It is really sad because they are really hurt over it. Politics is such a small part of life. I am not going to cut off family because of political beliefs. Never have, never will. I just don't discuss politics with the ones with different views than mine.

Ditto for coworkers and other people I know.

There is so much else to talk about.

But why would they ever, if they are never going to be forgiven?

Most are not the hardliners, and anyway they were fooled by a whole system designed to brainwash them. They're marks who have been conned, victims.

They did not know what they were doing. They should have but they were deceived. Their vote will definitely harm many. But I separate those who intended to harm them from those who were deceived and believed the lies.

Haven't seen that one in about 15 minutes.

If they like pineapple on their pizza and prefer Babylon 5 over Star Trek, that's fine.

If they vote for a rapist/racist/felon/traitor/bigot? Then fuck them. Fuck them. Fuck them. And then fuck them.

Pulling that pollyanna nonsense about "different views" is gaslighting 101. "Sure he's stabbing you in the throat with a rusty steak knife, but that doesn't mean he's a bad person."

Fuck them.

Most of my friends are Dems, but I would never cut a long time friend or family member out of my life because they have different views than me. My 2 Republican girl friends were there for me when I was sick - they grew up in conservative communities so it’s no shock they are Republicans even though we rarely mention politics.
I live outside a small town - probably half Dems & half Republicans. Our wonderful mayor is a Dem but also loved by many of the Republicans because he does so much for everyone. Mostly everyone is pretty friendly to everyone- I’m not going to not say Hi to a woman who has a Trump sign in her yard. This woman just lost her husband of 30 yrs and I choose to have compassion for her - not hate.

The dangerous MAGA cult is not about politics. It is about abuse, cruelty and chaos.

voters - at least 80% of my friends and acquaintances voted for him and most of my extended family voted for him too.

I am in the reddest county in the state. We took a stand against Trump after competitors took a stand for Trump back during his first term. Business improved and we sleep better. The only alternatives are to join the lynch mob, or enable it by normalizing it. It is the MAGA people who broke the social bonds. We are merely acting rationally based on that reality rather than living in denial and pretending everything is normal. They cut themselves off from everything that is honest, decent and humane. They are a threat to everyone and everything we hold dear. No, no, no.

No argument or anything, or him trying to force his views on you? You cut him off just because he had a Trump sign?

Seems a bit harsh to me, but then again I live in a Red area of Staten Island. All my neighbors are Trumpers, so I'd be a hermit if I cut them all off.

I paid him $200 plus I filled up his gas tank for about $70 for driving me to the ER. And it wasn't likely a life-threatening condition, it was a urinary blockage which felt like I was dying. Not that any of matters though. He's still a jerk and an ass for his loud and persistent support for Trump. So to hell with him.

62 year old brother and my 65 year old cousin because of Trump. It's quite simple. I will NEVER forgive him.

They failed to hear this monster. He told them he didn't care about them but yet they voted for a convicted felon

MAGA friends and family refused to hear me. That is the problem. I don't care about their so-called "views," but MAGA means they will not listen to anything I have to say. They hold that, and me, and everyone I care about, in contempt, murderous contempt. They are promoting abuse and cruelty, and doing that gleefully. That is not just a "different opinion." That is a dangerous cult. That is a lynch mob.

there is no one to blame but themselves. They knew who he is.

Many of them didn't think of themselves as voting for him, they were voting against a bunch of indoctrination about what Democrats stand for. Or they were voting their fears. I don't forgive them for being ignorant fools, nor for inflicting fascism upon the country, but some small portion of them that I might meet at the gym or grocery store, I am willing to occasionally interact with - for as brief a time as possible. Friends or family members - at this point if you voted for Republicans you are cut out of my life. Why have a connection & waste time with people that are idiots, malevolent, or both.

his rallies and hate speech. He told people in those rallies who he is and that was OK with everyone who voted for him. If they got the propaganda about Democrats they surely heard his message of hate and cruelty.

They are not worthy of my time. F Em. F Em all......

The only possible karma being if those who supported this Antichrist end up suffering as well.

We don’t forget though.

Unpardonable sin. I'm following his lead on this one and feel just fine about it.

We all have our own way. Peace.

Won't even tell them why they are in the wrong.

He’s quite butt hurt, but I don’t care. I refuse to deal with people who demonstrate their lack of concern for others.

I think it says: Don't Blame me I Voted for Sanity, (or something like that).

"Shut the hell up. THIS is what you voted for. Welcome to reality."

It's become impossible to call people my friends who support, even revere, Trump, his actions and his ultra wealthy friends who are hell bent on taking from the least among us. Where is their humanity?

I borrowed this since it rings true for me.

"The Good Samaritan
It just so happened that the gospel for the week after the election was the parable of The Good Samaritan.
If you're unfamiliar, a man was travelling and was attacked by thieves. They beat him, stole his belongings and left him to die by the side of the road. A priest and a Levite both came by and cross to the other side of the road to avoid him, but a Samaritan came by, dressed his wounds, took him to an inn, paid the innkeeper to care and feed him, and said that if more money was required, he would reimburse the inn on his return.
As this story was being read, I looked around and realized that more than half of the people hearing this story just voted for a rapist and a thief. I just couldn't stay, so I left.
It was a gut-punch. Those that supported Donnie Dipshit didn't just invalidate the act of the Samaritan. They didn't even just validate the acts of the priest and Levite.
No, the most disgusting thing is, they validated the acts of the thieves that robbed, beat and left the man to die."

Don't hold your breath.

MAGA supporters ever having any regrets? Let's look to history.

Here is what William Shirer, journalist and author of The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich, discovered when interviewing everyday Germans after WWII. Every German city lay in ruins and millions had been killed. The death camps and prison labor were well know. A generation of German men were dead or maimed.

"There was so much that was true that did not make sense: the monumental apathy of the German people and their deep regret, not that they had started the war, but merely that they had lost it; their whining complaints at the lack of food and fuel and their total lack of sympathy or even interest in the worse plight of the occupied peoples, for which they bore so much responsibility; their boredom at the very mention of the Nuremberg trial, which they were convinced was only an Allied propaganda stunt; their striking unreadiness for, or interest in, democracy, which we, with typical Anglo-Saxon fervor and blindness, were trying to shove down their throats."

― William L. Shirer, End of a Berlin Diary

Their deep regret, not that they had started the war, but merely that they had lost it. Let that sink in. FAFO? Hardly.

Thanks for posting this - spot on.

When we read this history about the German people, it is easy to think “That was THOSE people. That was THEN”.

Eyes wide open: That is THESE people. That is NOW.

There’s another post , asking why are people so unlike us.
I just don’t know. I will stay away from them.
We are Germany 1932. There’s no use to talk with them,
70 million of our citizens are so filled with fear and hate that they support a conman, liar, crook and traitor.
Racism, greed, and selfish stupidity. That’s what I’ve come to think. I understand what motivates racism and greed.
But , the purposeful ignorance is a hallmark of the self-righteous . They think they are experts on everything.
Yes, I blame Media and the fake religions.

In pictures:
What you wanted


What we all got
Death and suffering.


Do you want a reward or something?
How about taking a long walk on a very short pier?


FAFO!
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100219770873

My only consolation is that MAGATS will also suffer and I will laugh

be able to vote. I think they should be deported. But the DOJ did nothing so we screwed.

End of story.

I have chosen not to decorate my home for Christmas, in protest. It represents the darkness that so many voters have chosen for America. It's the first time since we bought our home in 1997 that it will be dark.

but not forget because everyone makes mistakes. However, I will never, ever, forget what they did and I will always remind and shame them for what they did.

People who did not vote Democratic cannot be called "Democrats."

mass sociopathy. they don't care at all about all the people who will suffer.

i expect they will care when it touches them.

Last edited Mon Dec 23, 2024, 10:19 PM - Edit history (1)

Nor should they be. Unless someone shows true remorse and states publicly that they made a terrible mistake and asks for forgiveness they don’t deserve that in my opinion, they should also be banned from regular society.

The problem is that a little over half the country, (meaning those who voted), voted for this. It shows you how crazy people here are and how heartless that they could vote for a psycho who murdered over 1 million Americans with Covid. Including my father. The death toll was way higher than has been recorded because a lot of deaths that were caused by Covid were not recorded as being from Covid, one, because a lot of people didn’t get treatment in the beginning and died at home never being tested etc., and two, because if some didn’t die right away, it’s not recorded as Covid, even though that led to their death.

In addition, I wonder how many people died or went crazy from the stress of having to be tortured by that psychopath for nine years now.

Fortunately, none of my family would ever support a fascist/ murderer, etc. I’m sure some of my neighbors probably voted for this. I don’t have anything to do with them anymore anyway so it doesn’t really matter. My last neighbor who was a friend died 2 years ago. Otherwise in public, I don’t discuss politics and I’m normally polite to everybody.

Ditto, they made that choice and I tried to give them a heads-up. I'm worried about the elders who didn't vote for 45

n/t

they disgraced America

Most are horribly misled.
Maybe don’t forgive or forget, but still keep your heart open for if the suffering comes it will come for us all. Remember Covid and the one thing the GOP’s dear leader won last time — the most deaths in the wealthy world.

He lives in a district heavily populated by right-wing Republicans. And on Facebook, I have read many messages written by right-wingers who have swallowed huge lies from various right-wing news sources, outrageous lies about how noble and hardworking and brilliant Trump is and how all the stories of his vicious, filthy, perverted life are terrible lies. I have told my husband that his brother probably had no way of knowing the truth.

👍

America is what it votes for.

Who now try to normalize him. Eg Fetterman

I agree with the sentiment, BUT there isn't going to be any money for a lot of the crap he's been promising. Mass deportations would cause a lot of pain in a hurry, but without funding it won't happen. Meanwhile, they'll pretend it is, and then blame Dems whenever truth comes out.

I don't forgive them because I don't think of them at all. If I am confronted by them I just say, Bless your heart, and move on. If you can help it don't let any of them rent any space in your brain.

Having said that, there IS one friend (Hell I'll say it..Lenny) Lenny's sisters and a brother plus mom and dad think Trump is the proverbial
savior. Lenny got INTO them like a pissed-off alligator. Told them they do not exist and worse. Lenny probably told them everything thought
and line, that is/was in this whole thread! He's my husband's best friend and I understand why. To Lenny...Voting for Trump is destroying
the very soil that Lenny was born on. Yeah Lenny is cool!

It blows my mind when I think about it. I'm still in a state of shock/stunned.

I do not associate with Nazis, period.

with no regrets. I will never forgive them. Ever. Fortunately my immediate family is as liberal as I am. Except for a few exceptions, it’s my extended family who have gone nuts. The other MAGA folks I know, I give the cold shoulder to when I see them. They know exactly how I feel. F’em

It will take a generation to erase the damages.

More than 1 generation (if ever). Germany is still dealing with it, and only now 3-4 generations later are they recovering.

No forgiveness for these people.

too bad, so sad.

Is this commonly discussed in your circle?

Just curious because I can't remember it coming up very often, if at all. Among my acquaintances, at least, it feels like most people have moved on and want to talk about something else.

But I never intended to

They will explain these are relatives and say how they agree not to talk politics. But this TRANSCENDS POLITICS.
And to make things worse if that's possible the MAGAts didn't just vote for Trump but also straight Republican for House and Senate, ensuring there will not be any branch of government to restrain him.

just silly wind catchers. They went full MAGA with Trump banners you could see down the block, now the have Trump face Christmas flags. I guess they wonder why no one wants anything to do with them. I now ignore them.

If the original 2016 voters hadn't supported him, we wouldn't be here and now with a pending crisis.

Because they were afraid of and despised Hillary Clinton as much as they saw Trump as their savior, their advocate, their leader.

But I do note apathy from my siblings on the subject of trump and it seems they should be up in arms about him. I don't know anyone who supports him, except likely my republican cousins who live far away. One sent me an Xmas card with a picture of a round ornament with red, white and blue, and I thought that was in bad taste for an Xmas card, but also a definite signal about likely being a trump supporter

I really want the felon to do his worst so these voters suffer acutely and realize how truly bad he is and how much he lied to them.

Dems can hopefully captialize on the horrors of the next 2 years and take back congress.

Having said that repubs are so brainwashed they may reward them with bigger majorities and Dems never learn the lesson on how to fight.

People denied voting for bush almost immediately.
They will deny voting for trmp too.
Imo...trmp wasn't duly elected and the 14th Amendment says so. That's why the Constitution is there. It's a document tha protects us all.
The SC changed the Constitution without a Constitutional Convention. And we just rolled over and went back to sleep.

How The Supreme Court broke the Constitution and the Country.

They absolutely approved the suffering, thinking voting for Trump meant they were immune, but fine with mass deportations and letting poor kids starve ect.

I have a lot of trouble with the amorphous concept of "forgiveness", I won't turn my head and say "poor MAGA", feeling sad for them as we all pay the price. It is not in my nature to confront people about how they vote either. I try to be civilized and throw in some results they may not have considered, unless they are harsh with me. But forgiveness and no forgiveness mean nothing to me, (their religious origins, I am sure, have a lot to do with that). They think we are baby-killers and we think they are angry idiots, which is the worst to be called?

We all need to take care of ourselves as best we can. Trump voters don't DESERVE for the rest of us to obsess on them, that can only hurt us, but I know that I won't try to gloss over how the MAGA anger and willfull ignorance is already hurting the country and the world, no one will blind me to that by "forgiveness". Yea they were duped by RW media and conspiracies, but they chose to listen to the rage-bate, I won't think well of them or make a bunch of excuses for them in order to be considered "forgiving'. I can't imagine a more heartless, angry and IDIOTIC group of people. I welcome any of them who come to their senses though.

I envision flying flags that say - "We Told You So" or "You Did This!", as it all falls apart.

But "we" tend not to wave big giant flags on our property, the way the Maga brigade does. And of course "we" would risk being "turned in" or otherwise targeted by our neighbors and fellow citizens.